Question: I hired a contractor to install Bruce hardwood floor 3/8″ thick. They were going to glue down the hardwood. They came & ripped up the carpet today & discovered that the sub-floor is very uneven, by about 1/2″ at certain point. Some area looks wavy. The subfloor is made of particle boards. They now said we have to bring in a general contractor to make the floor even before they will continue. Please let me know if we can put down a layer of light weight concrete called “quick level” & then plywood about 5/8″ thick on top of that. This is on the second floor. There is another floor underneath this. we do not want regular concrete because it would be too heavy. Do you have any other recommendations that we can look into to make the subfloor more even. Thanks so much in advance for your help. Mary Answer: Dear Mary You are lucky they halted the job, before going ahead and creating a poor installation. I’ve heard too many horror stories about humpy subfloors. They would have blamed in on your house condition. But to answer your question, no, you should not try the quick fix of pouring lightwieght concrete on the particle board, it will be cracked up in no time. Simply hire a carpenter to remove all the particle board, sister the joists, if they are out of level, and install new 3/4″ plywood subfloor. Or upon removal of the particle baord, you find another layer of old subfloor shim it level and install a thinner 1/2″ plywood. Either case it’s a floor carpentry job, that is out the expertise of these installers. You can then have a glued or nailed down hardwood floor installed. I don’t know why your hardwood floor supplier did not tell you all this before you bought the wood. You may consider this all too exepnsive and may now want to return the wood, which should be an option. As always your Most humble servant, Joseph, the Wood Floor Doctor.

Question: Sorry for the lack of details. It is a prefinished solid oak strip. I believe it’s part of the Natural Reflections line and I think it’s 3/4 IN X 2 1/4 IN X Random Lengths. It has square edges and ends. The flooring guy says that Bruce should take care of the cost, but my point is that we are going to end up with a floor that is not of the quality that we paid $5,000 for. I was told that we shouldn’t have to worry about refinishing it for 25 years, if ever. I am going to approach them about getting a full refund. Does that sound reasonable? Marc Answer: Dear Marc You know, warranties are no substitute for good products. It sounded like you have bought one of the better of the Bruce products, and the only thing I object to is the so called square ends and edges. This is the type of floor that I had my problems with. Bruce doesn’t seem to have the good factory control to mill and finish this tricky floor on a consistent basis. I hardly ever install prefinished floor these days. I cannot honestly say I have ever really liked any of my prefinished jobs once completed. Frankly the whole prefinished floor business is a hit or a miss operation as far as I can see. The warranties are just the fire wall they have tried to put up, it serves no real purpose other than to keep you coming back. The floor finish will wear out well before 25 years, but odds are you will not be in this house. They are betting on this. If I were you I would go for a full refund. You could have them remove all the floor if they wish, but have them put you up in a hotel, if they really want to take full responsibility. If not get the refund, and consider having the floor removed and replaced with a better product. I would find a good wood floor contractor, have him install an unfinished floor, sand and finish it on site with 3-4 coats of oil mod. poly. If you treat this smoothly finished floor correctly (read my articles) I can assure you you will get 10 years out of the finish before it need re-coating. And 3 re-coatings later that brings you to a minimum of 40 years without having to re-sand. You would never hear that from one of those floor boutiques. This has been the normal maintenance schedule for sand on site floor, for most of this century. You don’t need miracle finishes, just good cheap maintenance. And it is a lot easier to clean a floor sanded smooth than those bumpy prefinished floors. I’m going to write an article soon about the sham of those warranties. Removing and replacing a wood floor is only done once every century or two. Just what kind of junk is this company using when it won’t last 6 months ? Please don’t show this to your contractor, they get very litigious these days, even when they are wrong. Remember Oprah and the beef guys. This is a private letter between ourselves, not meant to be publicly displayed. As always your Most humble servant, Joseph, the Wood Floor Doctor.

Question: Doc, I have 2,000 square ft. of 3 x 3 mesquite end grain tiles. We have other hardwood floors in our house that needed some attention, so we decided to reseal the mesquite why we were at it. I used the same person who originally installed the floors. When we first put them in 5 years ago we used satin Duraseal to coat the floors with. They looked absolutely beautiful. He has screened the floors with a 180 and 120 grit paper to remove the old sealer and vacuumed the remnants up. He then wiped the floors down with mineral spirits. Once the floors were completely decontaminated he applied his Duraseal. After 24 hrs of drying the floors felt smooth but had the appearance of streaks. He has now repeated the same process three more times with the same results. Our last try we used a matte finish to see if it helped. The floors have the same streaky appearance again. How do we get rid of these streaks. PLEASE HELP, we want our pretty floors back. I have taken several pictures and chose these to send. You can see it better when i turned the lights down. I hope this helps. Thanks, Patrick Answer: Hi Patrick, There are many possible reasons for streak marks on your floor. It is pretty unlikely but it could be that your flooring contractor did an uneven sanding job. That would mean that he may have actually removed all of the old sealer in some places and left remnant of it in other spots. He could have also applied the mineral spirits unevenly. Certain spots would be darker than others if some of the old sealer was still on some areas of the floor. The most important thing is THREE coast of oil modified polyurethane. This ensures even coats and no streaking. If you have streak marks, it means that certain spots on your floor probably have more finish than other spots. If your floor finish is uneven, he may have done all of the right steps but if he never went over the finish, there very well could be streak marks left behind. The solution to your streaky floor is to invite your flooring contractor back and get him to do another 2 coats of oil modified polyurethane. The sanding job was done slightly incorrectly. You must screen the bare wood with 100 grit sandpaper before doing your staining job. 180 grit sandpaper is actually too high. Keep that in mind for the future. If you say your floor is smooth, that is great. The most probable reason that you have streak marks is caused by either trowel marks or brush marks (depending what your floor contractor used as an applicator). This is what I do: I like to apply my first coat of polyurethane with a 12″ drywall trowel. I usually thin the finish I use (Fabulon Brand heavy-duty poly satin but Duraseal is good too) about 3-5% when I am troweling it. This particular brand has a bit too much body for troweling. In my case want to slow the drying down on this first coat, so I add odorless mineral spirits. I want to prevent trowel marks. I pour a puddle of this slightly thinned finish on the floor, and work it back and forth (just like glue troweling). Make sure he gives the surface a light sand only. He should only sand with 100 grit screen paper. This will bring him back to the bare wood. Make sure he does the entire floor if you want your finish to look even. Good luck! FOLLOW UP: Doc, I think we solved our problem. My contractor decided to try to buff out the streaks, and it works. Yeah!!!

Question: I have been using feast watson floor sealer (tung oil) do you know how toxic this is? Answer: Dear Stewart You must be from Australia, as this is the only place I could find info on this product. And the closest I could find was the Orica Woodcare products manufacturing co. They make the Feast Watson brand of finishes, along with Cabot and Intergrain. Here is a list of the stuff they put into this mildly toxic stuff. This was taken from the Cabot Danish oil web site, and this is most likely similar or the same as the Feast Watson. CABOTS DANISH OIL Lighting kerosene 8008-20-6 HIGH Synthetic polymer – HIGH Light aromatic petroleum naphtha 64742-95-6 MED Medium aliphatic hydrocarbon 64742-88-7 MED Additives – LOW Solvents in very low proportions – VLOW Unlike here in North America they don’t have to list the percentages of the ingredients, but typically these oil/varnishes contain about 80% solvents. These range form the safest called odorless mineral spirits (also called light aromatic naphtha) to the more toxic trimethylbenzene (which is probably the synthetic polymer) and lastly and worstly the Kerosene. Kerosene is a possible carcinogen, a severe mutagen, (causes inherited defects) and a severe skin irritant. All the solvents have the effect of causing drowsiness, hallucinations and distorted perceptions. And are all very flammable. So all in all I would say this stuff is very toxic and you would be exposed to less toxins if you thinned (with odorless mineral sprits) a good quality oil modified polyurethane and used this a first coat instead. I simply use a 14″ steel drywall trowel to apply a thin coat of my favorite poly (full strength) and avoid most all of these deadly solvents, and expense. But I do wait at least overnight for this to dry. But in most cases this is the end of a long floor sanding day, and I am glad to go home. If you want to try a really non-toxic oil finish take a look at Tried And True oil/varnish at http://www.triedandtruewoodfinish.com. This finish has NO petroleum based solvents and no metallic dryers. But it may be too weak for floors. You would need to apply at least 5-6 coats over about a 2 week period, scuff sanding between all coats. As always your Most humble servant, Joseph, the Wood Floor Doctor.

Question: Hi one more question for you… I am planing some old 5 inch tx FIR planks that were in my basement (they had paint on them) and will use them as a floor in the kitchen. If I run the tongues and grooves through the edger/jointer I get a much nicer joint and it cleans up the edges, but it makes the tongue considerably smaller, and doesn’t have the rounded edge on it anymore. It is a beautiful fit afterword, I am only concerned about the size of the tongue. Is this a problem to make the t & g smaller? Will I run in to problems in the future? Thanks Ben Ross, first time old house owner Answer: Dear Ben Don’t make those tongues any smaller or at least try to keep them to no less than 1/4″. The reason for this is that when these wide boars shrink seasonally they will need all this leeway in order that the next board’s edge groove won’t start popping up. Yes, these floors can easily have 1/4″ gaps between them after a humid summer followed by a long dry heating season. Just hand scrape the tongues clean. Be sure to read my article in the hardwood Authority section on Plank Floor, about the proper subfloor requirements for this wide floor, and the fastening schedule. Don’t treat this like a strip floor, you will regret it. If you live in a damp climate with a crawl space under the floor, consider applying one coat of poly on the under side of the planks. This floor sadly will not hold up well in a kitchen. But if you must, apply at least 5 coats of an oil modified poly on it and expect to recoat the floor every 2-4 years. Fir is not fairly moisture stable, but dents and edge splinters easily. Be sure to have the floor sanded by a pro, but do the finishing yourself. I like using the Fabulon brand heavy duty pro poly. If you found this information helpful, please explore the Wood Floor Doctor.com by visiting the rest of our website. As always your Most humble servant, Joseph, the Wood Floor Doctor.

Question: The house is out of the warrantee period. The floors are sand in place type. It would be impossible to remove the sub floor for it is part of an engineered diaphragm. The sub floor was glued down with a urethane adhesive and screws. Yes the floor got wet during the construction, but seemed to be flat to a straight edge. The floor is not accessible from below, so I was thinking of two solutions. 1) The floor is laid across the floor trusses. The floor truss system is on 24″ centers so I could top nail the floor down to the trusses @ 2 nails per board @ 2′ intervals. 2) A more drastic approach would be to strip all the floors off, sand the sub floor and glue and nail 3/8″ plywood down as a new base on top of the existing floor. Thanks Dwight Answer: Dear Dwight The first mistake the builders made is the 24″ centers of the trusses. The only material that could span such a distance would 1″ solid plywood. Builders and engineers make the mistake of building just to safely and load guidelines. And a 3/4″ OSB will sure span such a distance safely but not without pops and squeaks. And that’s the rub, why must we live in expensive but aesthetically inferior new building, just so builders can save 5 dollars a sheet using substandard, but known inferior materials. But I digress. The second mistake was allowing the OSB to get soaked. But first, during the OSB manufacturing process some of the small chips of wood are bent as they are being bonded and pressed into layers. During the rain the swelling opens those bent and folded chips and when compressed for a second time by your walking on them, they finally break. If there are only a few of these fibers breaking you will only hear a slight cracking sound, but some people experience popping sounds like Rice Crispies. The OSB manufactures say this is a manufactured-related characteristic, and they take no responsibility for this problem. Even still the Louisiana-Pacific Corporation has been saddled with multiple class action lawsuits since 1997 because of OSB panel failures. But like I said once the fiber is finally broken, it will lay cracked but quiet. Since this material has 4 times the resin content of plywood, it also has the tendency to bend more than plywood. And the 24″ centers have just added to this deflection. This is well known in the building industry, and a short visit to any plywood association web sites will confirm what I say. Because the two major hardwood flooring associations have accepted OSB with open arms this has become the industry standard for subfloor requirements for hardwood floors. So everybody passes the buck as they line their pockets at your expense. I can only make the following suggestions, and I would wait several years before considering this repair as the popping sound I think (and hope) will get better on its own. At the very least you should nail down 5/8″ plywood (over the OSB) hitting the joists with 4″ spiral nails. I say this is the least because the hardwood flooring nails will still penetrate the OSB 1/4″. But I would hope this would not cause too many squeaks in the future. And this will keep from raising the final floor level too much, so as making too high a rise to the various stair cases. But 3/4″ plywood on top of the OSB would be better, as the flooring nails will almost only contact the plywood, and be as if the OSB wasn’t there at all. And the very best thing to do is to remove all or most of this substandard building material (OSB) and replace it with 1″ plywood, or even 1″ by 4″ Southern Yellow Pine laid diagonally to the joists. This last suggestion makes the very best nailing surface for hardwood flooring, if you’ve got really deep pockets. Your 3/8″ solution may not be enough. And any plywood covering the OSB should be glued on the joist line and between the joists. And urethane adhesive is best, but you may have to mist it if the wood MC is below 8%. And don’t dismiss the squeakenders or sagenders solution, it may be a lot less disruptive to work under the floor than on top. You can use the sagenders to add plywood panels to the underside, thus ending the deflection. But if you must work from the top you can use a nail spinner to spin in 3″ spiral finishing nails just where you said. Nail spinners can be bought at http://www.leevalley.com, order product #99K20.01. They work a lot better and faster than preboring, I use them in all my installations and repairs.

Question: Hi Doc, I’m interested in the learning how to build my business as a hardwood floor contractor. Thanks Doc! Brent Answer: Dear Brent The key to writing a good job contact is to keep it simple. But you do have to have the essential information. Make sure you have your full company name, address and phone number at the top. And date every quotation, and describe the name and address of the owner of the building. Find out right off it this is the owner that you are giving the quote to. If it is a rental unit, you should suggest to the tenant that they ought to get the owner’s written permission to do work on the floor. And at this point if you do find out that you will be contracting for a tenant or worse yet a contractor, you should beware. If you go ahead and do this job and the non-owning contractee doesn’t want to pay, you may have some difficulty with enforcing the contract. The mechanics lien act in your province will protect you to some degree, but without the owner of the building involved, you may have some difficulty collecting your contract. This document should be called a quotation. It doesn’t become a contact in any case until the owner of the property has agreed have you do the job. Don’t be presumptuous. Describe the scope of the job like this: To sand and finish all main floor hardwood floors with 3 coats of polyurethane. If you know that you are up against stiff competition for this job, describe the job with much more detail like: To sand hardwood floor with coarse, medium and fine grits sandpaper, on drum sander, and edge three times, with final edging done with a vibrator to eliminate edger marks. Then finish the floor with 3 separate coats of oil based polyurethane scuffing and cleaning between coats to eliminate bubbles and nibs. Specify a satin or gloss finish. Specify the stain (if any) brand that you will use. The point is that this detailed approach is for the very wary buyer, who want to know why he should hire you and not just any floor sander in the phone book. You may have a specific and unique way of sanding and finishing a floor, and you should put this into the quotation. Just be sure to do what you say. With a new floor installation, you must see the subfloor before you can say that the type of floor your potential client wants is suitable. You are the expert, so there is no defense in any court that will stand when you installed a floor incorrectly, no matter what the reason. If you see an inadequate or bumpy subfloor, you should walk away from such jobs, if the client doesn’t want to pay for some remedial work on the surface before the installation begins. You will be blamed for a squeaky, bumpy floor, if you do not. And it does no good at all to put riders in the quote absolving yourself from responsibility. These never hold up in court, trust me on this. I’ve seen it happen. Same goes for installing a new floor when you know that it is too early in the construction schedule. Don’t get bullied by home owners and contractors to install a nice kiln dried floor in a damp unheated construction site. When this floor shrinks and gaps in the next heating season, guess who they will call to fix it? And guess who is liable? You beccha you are. Don’t do jobs with materials and methods you know are not sound, the most profitless job is the one you have to do twice. So after you have described the job, quote the price including all taxes. Even if you are quoting for repairs, some provincial laws now state that the final bill has to with 10% of the quote price. So even shimming, leveling or repairing a subfloor has to have a price. You might state that the carpet has to be removed before you can quote on any subfloor work. But any repairs to an existing floor, be sure to describe each and every area that they want repaired. This does two things: you will not end up doing extra work you hadn’t counted on for nothing, the quote would have laid out the exact scope of the repair work. And also when you do get to the job, sometime weeks later, the quote will make sure that you have repaired everything that you said you would. I sometimes state that the floor needs repairing in six areas, with a brief description of each area, and how the repair is to be done. Staggered in or not. When you are describing a new floor be sure to name the species, grade and size. And which direction the wood is to be laid. I usually put it like this : Supply and install 3 1/4″ select and better red oak strip floor in living and dining room. Sand and finish same floor with 3 coats of polyurethane. Supply and install oak quarter round and any need transition strips finished the same as the floor. What you don’t want in any quotation is any exemption of liability. You don’t want to say that any damage to paint or wallpaper will not be your responsibility. Because I assure you, it will be, no matter what you say in your quotation. As far as warranties, never give a warranty over one year. And this would apply only to new floors. The reason is simple. The floor will experience all seasons. And as long as you have installed the floor over a good sound subfloor, and finished it well, everything will be fine as long as your clients know how to take care of the wood and the finish. You could direct them to my floor maintenance article, and they should know that for a wood floor boards to remain tight they will need to control the humidity range in their house. Now don’t tell them this after they have paid you, as they may see this as you building some limitations to the warranty. Instead state this right up front in a discussion, as to what they expect from a wood floor, and the hygroscopic nature of wood. Try to say wood floor, not hardwood floors. This terminology gives people the correct idea about what they are about to buy. It is not some indestructible factory produced floor. It is a wood floor. They will treat if better knowing this, and you will never have a call back, if you took the time to educate them first. Oh, and prefinished floor warranties should STAY with the company that made this floor. Be sure to show your client the written factory warranty when you do the quote. Don’t show it to them as you are installing it, they may be somewhat miffed when they see all the exceptions, and feel misled by you when they thought you would be standing behind the warranty. Who knows if these companies will be in business 25 years from now, look what has happened to Armstrong. You can and should warranty any defects in your installation of a prefinished floor for a year, and this is standard. Lastly state in the quote just how long this price is good for, and sign your name to it. Do not pressure anyone into deciding that instant to choose you. Consumer laws in most provinces have a cooling off period in any case, so it’s best to let them decide in their own. On the back you should have a list of your many references. And you might want to ask for a 10% deposit for a guaranteed start date. You will have to start then, or return the deposit if you fail to start on this date. Once they have decided on you, give then an accurate and honest idea of how long the job will take, before they can use the floor again. Curing times of the finish should be mentioned, rugs replaced on the wood, and things like that. Keep to the schedule, knock yourself out to stay on schedule. If you start an oil poly job in the middle of a hot and humid summer without AC, you should warn of possible delays. And if you have damaged any paint or walls, tell your clients the day it happened, and what you can do to fix it. Tell them up front if they should expect any minor paint damage and exactly where and why, like at the bottom of quarter round moulding. But like I said tell then this up front in person, don’t write it into the contract. Trust people to be honest, and they will never let your down. But be honest with them at all times. The contract is secondary to this.

Question: Nice website. Very informative. I am a wood installer in Palm Beach and would like to go expand into finishing. We have some common traits like pride in our work and a desire to do it to spec. This is often not appreciated in this prefinished hell I call palm beach county. I am presentley installing 4,000 sq ft of 2 1/4 #2 common red oak on floating rubber thruster system and the contractor cannot find anyone to finish the floor. Brian Answer: Dear Brain Sorry it took so long to get back to you, it’s wonderful to hear from a fellow tradesman. As you can see by this big job “going a begging”, there is a large and growing market for qualified and skilled floor sanders. By installing these floors only, you are missing out on the other half of the trade. Floor sanding and finishing, doesn’t sound glamorous, but it sure is profitable. Once you’ve got some sanding and finishing skills, you’ll find your services in big demand. I don’t do ANY prefinished floors anymore (and haven’t for 3 years now) and I am presently booked up until Jan, 2004. And these are all nice custom residential jobs, with the sanding and finishing component of the job priced at 4 dollars a square foot and up. Looks like I’ll be able to raise my prices next year by about 10%. I don’t even advertise anymore. And I charge 30 dollars for a quote in person, go figure. So, Brain, buy and read my famous “how to” articles, and get some sanding machines and get out of that prefinished hell. Don’t move out of Palm Beach, just create a new a unique market there. My article “Better Prices” can help you stay well ahead of the competition. Stay tuned to this web site, lots more interesting articles and videos coming this fall and winter.

Question: I’ve noticed everyone recommends 3 coats of polyurethane (I’m using Polo Plaz semi-gloss on a newly sanded floor). I’ve already put on a coat of sealer and two coats of poly. Is that my 3, or do you recommend one more coat of polyurethane? I notice that my floor isn’t quite as smooth feeling as I’d like, but it looks awesome. Thanks in advance, Jeremy Answer: Dear Jeremy As long as you used the Polo-Plaz vinyl / urethane quick dry sealer you are done. This is one of the better sealers on the market. One of the reasons I use only Oil Modified Polyurethane for all coats is that it makes future touch ups really easy. And expensive sealers, while nice to use are really not needed for durability, just speed of drying. You should have spent more time screening the sealer and second coat, and getting the floor really clean. Now that’s yet another reason why I use a thin coat of OMU for the first coat. I simply want that coat to be as smooth as possible, so I may screen it to the point of going through the first coat of finish, in a few spots. I really only want the first coat of OMU to fill up the pores of the wood, I don’t want a build of rough finish. Now that said, if I happen to scuff through my first thin coat of Oil Modified Polyurethane, that’s not a problem for me, as I am using the same finish for all three coats. If on the other hand you mistakenly screen through the first coat of these lighter toned sealers, you will have a dark spot in the floor, as the urethane top coat hits it, and a major touch up dilemma. But like I said your method is faster, just not better. I have to always wait over night for my first thin coat of OMP to dry. But in any case I would never use any type of sealer over a stain. Sometimes mistakes will occur in the middle of finishing a job ( like having to replace a bad board), and knowing all three coats are the same is nice, as I know any mistakes can be corrected and still blend it in. I have just completed an extensive article about just how best to apply OMP to hardwood floors, without the associated bubbles and pits. As always your Most humble servant, Joseph, the Wood Floor Doctor.

Question: It’s me AGAIN. Yesterday my guy put the third coat of polyurethane on – a very thick coat of satin – and I absolutely HATE the way it looks. I asked for satin instead of semigloss, and he wanted to do a real thick layer to reduce any screening scratches that appeared; it all sounded very logical, but what really astonished me was to come home and see a floor that looks like a totally fake plastic linoleum floor, which totally defeats the purpose of all the trouble and expense I went to to put in a natural solid wood floor. I don’t know what to do now. I am probably stuck with it because I need to sell the house in the next month or two and I don’t have time to fool around with this; hopefully the prospective buyers won’t be as grossed out as i am by it – but is this because it’s such a thick layer? How do I avoid this in the future? thanks Debbie Answer: Dear Debbie Quite possibly you had been expecting less of a film on the floor when you were seeing the rather thin coats of sealer. And, there are a lot of brands of satin finish poly, some more appealing than others. I have always (or at least for the last 15 years) used the Fabulon Brand satin poly. It has a nice glow to it, but I think, does not make the floor look like plastic. And I hate to say this but for easy floor maintenance you really do need at least 3 MODERATE coats of poly on a wood floor. I would never try to apply more than 500 square feet per gal of any oil based poly finish. Too thick a coat will take months to cure hard, and this can weaken the finish. Your floor contractors methods of using the sealer are questionable in my opinion. I’ll bet if you had taken the time to actually see some of his jobs, you might have not chosen him. Be sure to read my Hiring Contractors articles in the How to section of this web site. Just because the guy does High End work, doesn’t mean a thing. Even wealthy folks can be fooled. Use your own judgment. Oh, and here are a couple of pics of some of my satin poly’d floors. One with a stain and one with just the poly. Does your floor look anything like this ? As always your Most humble servant, Joseph, the Wood Floor Doctor.